Ajax

by Jeff Jolley

Mitchel of Ajax spent the most generous amount of time speaking with RAD Cyberzine about her musical career: about her past, where she is now, and where she (and Ajax) hopes to be in the future. But most importantly, we were able to talk deeply (heart to heart, one might say) about her cats.

RAD: Going through your bio it's kinda hard to tell how long Ajax has been together.
Mitchel: I guess it got together around '89. I was working with two other people at the time and we sort of just got together to write this kind of industrial song called "Mind the Gap" because we had been to England and there was this recorded thing "Mind the Gap" at the tube station. So everybody was kind of doing sort of housier stuff, but we wanted to combine it with more industrial. So we just ended up writing that song. We didn't really plan on turning it into a group or anything. But we gave it to Wax Trax, and they ended up signing us and so they wanted us to do a whole album.

So I guess, really, in '89 and we released "Mind the Gap" I think it was '90, and then the album right after that, '90-'91. It was alright at first. We did some shows here and there, but we never really tour with it. We did sort of a cheap video, and then they weren't interested in doing another album because budgets were really low and they were about to go under anyway. Kind of a bad time. And then I stopped working with those people.

One of the guys went on to do a book about the grunge scene that just came out. I think he sort of positioned it about Coutney Love mostly, because he used to go out with her. Kind of like his claim to fame....
RAD: And, of course, working with you....
Mitchel: Yeah, I'm waiting for that book to come out next. The other guy is not doing music at all anymore. He sort of moved to the country. It wasn't a good experience at all for him. So now I'm working with Joe Hornof.
RAD: Yeah, when did you and Joe get together?
Mitchel: About two and a half years ago. I just gave him a tape and said that I want to do something different. And when he called me back and said, "Oh, that's the same thing I want to do" (that no one else had understood). We started working together and did the whole band thing again, but it just didn't work out. We basically changed direction about three times in the 2 1/2 years that we've been together.
RAD: I'd like to talk a bit about music and the internet. I talk to a lot of bands who say, "Oh, yeah, I think the internet is cool," but they know nothing about it. What do you think about the internet, how long have you been on the internet?
Mitchel: About a year and a half.
RAD: How have you found the music scene there?
Mitchel: You know, it's weird, because when I first started doing it I was like, "WOW! This is unbelievable." I really thought that I'd hear about music that I'd never heard about before and that I'd find all this cool stuff that was just completely different and would really open up my eyes. Now, I don't really feel as passionate about it as that. I sort of think of it as a lot of the stuff I kind of already know about, and I'm not seeing any really really new thing pop up, except for local bands and things like that, that are just really letting people know they exist.

But people are willing to give information, or willing to answer a question. Where someone is asking about a song, oh that song is called this, written by this person, and you can buy it at this record store. People are willing to give information, and I like that part of it. I'll put out a post and people will send me all kinds of Email121112111211 back saying, "what can I do to help," "I'll call these record stores," or "I heard the song on the radio, and I want to do something so I'll call the radio station six times today and request it."

And that is so encouraging, because I want this stuff to get out there as well, because this is what I do. I'm not pretending in my room and making songs for my cats. I really want this to happen for me and for a lot of other reasons. I think it's good, and I think I have something positive to say, and all of that. And when I get that kind of feedback, I think that's the best because people are still positive and not completely jaded.

We have met some really good people, actually. People who have become really good friends, that we have to remind ourselves, "how do we know this person, again?"
RAD: Yeah, you can get really close to people. I've found one of the best groups of people I've been associated with is the 4AD mail121112111211ing list. They have a very international flair and very interesting look on music. I learned a lot about some cool music by hanging out with that group.

You said that the internet isn't as underground as you hoped it would be. Where do you think "the underground" in music is? Is it still New York?
Mitchel: You know, I don't even think it's New York. It's funny, I'm doing a thing for Spanish Television--not Spanish television in New York, but Spanish Television in Spain that this friend of mine is affiliated with. I'm producing this thing on Clubs in New York. We're going from a poetry reading and ending up in a hip hop, so we're doing like seven different genres in one night. I've called all these places--most places I've been to, but some places that I've heard about that are really new, that are supposed to still be "underground"--and it's like everybody is advertising in paper magazine and they advertise in the Voice, and when I ask them about that, I say, "why is this not really underground anymore?" And they go, "oh, well, no one would come if we didn't put it in the paper." And even four years ago NOTHING was advertised, you just had to know. It's kind of just clique-y in a way to expect people to know, and people that knew, of course, knew by word-of-mouth and in the beginning the same group of people, but that goes pretty quickly. Like when there's something great that's happening people just talk about it, so everyone will find out eventually.

And as far as the internet, it just seems like people still say, "Who is Portishead?" As early as a week ago somebody wrote, "I heard this really cool song--it has the word 'Seether' in it!" And of course the guy got completely flamed. And I'm exaggerating, because the guy didn't get flamed as much as I thought. At one turn, they seem completely up on everything and at the same time, completely out of it. You know, you read alt.music.alternative, and that's what I'm talking about.
RAD: Is Ajax looking for a label?
Mitchel: Yeah. I mean, we want to keep Infinite Love growing-that's our little label we have now. I would like to help people and get some records out, but we just don't have any money. It takes us all of our energy and all of our money just to get this one single. It takes a lot to make a dent.

Some people are happy just putting a single out and being able to play with their band, because they have a contained band and doing it that way. But, we're not really like that, because we don't have a band-band together. The only thing we can do is record more music and put records at the moment. And then eventually play out. But right now, I'm sort of limited to doing it on my own.
RAD: When's the next full album due out?
Mitchel: We have it done. We have a lot of songs completed--about twelve. And five that are in various stages. If something comes along, then we'll take it and put out an album as soon as we can. But it's like the business thing and the art thing couldn't be further apart. It's all very strange to me. What we do to make money is write stuff for television.
RAD: Yeah, like with The Big Picture and stuff?
Mitchel: Yeah...how did you know we did that? And a lot of stuff for VH1...ESPN. That's our big thing right now is ESPN stuff...E! Entertainment. Sometimes we make a lot of money, sometimes we make no money. We just came out of a hole, looking at each other like, "We haven't made money in four months!" Not one job, but now all of a sudden we have a lot of work.

And with Ex-Junkie, it's kind of like everything is happening now, which is usually the case.

When we work a lot, like the TV stuff, we don't take that long. We just knock out demos and then if we get the job it's just honing the demo and mixing it. Other stuff is already written, or if we're working with Tim and Rita to do something else...it doesn't require all of us to do phone work. We kind of split it up so that we can be creative and they can do the business. I like to go back and forth, like I can do the business for a while as much as I can tolerate it, and then I go, "That's enough for a while." That's how we have it worked out.
RAD: How many cats do you have?
Mitchel: Two. I have the mother and the daughter. The mother has what they say is breast cancer. I have a hard time believing that a cat could have breast cancer, but that's what they told me. They removed the lump and then it grew back a couple of months later. I don't know how long she can go like this, but it's already been a year and a half. And we have the daughter. Do you have cats?
RAD: No, I want to get a dog. My wife wants me to get a dog, I don't know. Ohhh...what's your favorite canned food?
Mitchel: Canned food?
RAD: Yeah, food found in a can...
Mitchel: I don't know. I don't eat canned food...
RAD: ...Good answer...
Mitchel: ...I eat fresh food. The only canned food I deal with is for the cat. And that's when we're completely broke. Otherwise I give her this other food that's better food. I don't even know what's in cat food. But that's the only canned food I use...I mean I have in the house. Yeah, when I'm really broke I eat cat food.

We go to this really sleazy supermarket, and there are these old baglady-women in there. They don't have anything, but they have 25 cats. This one woman was filling up her shopping cart with tons of cat food, and she said to me, "Oh honey, buy some more cat food. It's four for a dollar! It's NEVER this cheap!" So Joe started to say really loud, "Let's get some more cat food. We haven't gotten paid in four months and this is all we can afford." And we talk like this and people believe you there, because that's what they're doing. "Let's get the salmon tonight. Let's treat ourselves!"